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Consolation
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| Joined: | Mon Apr 9th, 2007 |
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Posted: Sat Mar 22nd, 2008 12:25 pm |
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I agree that taking 3 SAT IIs on one day isn't advisable. My S said it would have been too much, and he's an ace standardized test-taker also.
On the other hand, do be aware that he can choose to take another test on the day and they will bill you later. A few tests are not given at every session, such as the languages with listening. Other than that, they are normally available.
My S took Chemistry separately, and then Math IIC and French on the same day. There was some possibility that he would take Bio also as a backup, but we left it that he could go ahead and do so if he felt like it after the other two. He didn't feel like it. 
A downside of doing multiples is that although you have a few days to cancel your score, you have to cancel ALL the scores that day, not just the test you think you bombed.
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DesperateDad
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| Joined: | Tue Mar 14th, 2006 |
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Posted: Sat Mar 22nd, 2008 03:14 pm |
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Deja:
for math 2 (May), it depends on the high school curriculum...for example, our precalc class doesn't cover one strand of math that is on the test until early June, so Math 2 is a standard June subject test for our HS kids. May is for Subject Tests that correspond to APs, since the study overlaps. Then, June can be used as a retake, if necessary.
Last edited on Sat Mar 22nd, 2008 03:14 pm by DesperateDad
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outwest
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Posted: Sat Mar 22nd, 2008 06:28 pm |
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My oldest D took 3 sat2s at once and was brain dead by the third. She didn't score as well on that one and retook it in June (much better!). My youngest chose to only take two the first time using the middle hour as a break and snack time to regroup. She took the third one in the fall. I agree that taking all three at once is too much when you are trying to stay sharp and focussed. I think it is because the tests are all so different. One hour Biology then you have to change gears for English then change gears for math, all in quick succession.
That's just my opinion.
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Deja
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Posted: Sat Mar 22nd, 2008 07:59 pm |
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outwest wrote: My oldest D took 3 sat2s at once and was brain dead by the third. She didn't score as well on that one and retook it in June (much better!). My youngest chose to only take two the first time using the middle hour as a break and snack time to regroup. She took the third one in the fall. I agree that taking all three at once is too much when you are trying to stay sharp and focussed. I think it is because the tests are all so different. One hour Biology then you have to change gears for English then change gears for math, all in quick succession.
That's just my opinion.
Since my oldest only took one SAT2 test (and I only took one at a time back in the day), I hadn't really thought through the logistics of taking multiple tests. I didn't realize that the kids could take a break between two exams. That sounds like a very good idea!!!
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limner
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| Joined: | Sun Jul 16th, 2006 |
| Location: | Tennessee USA |
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Posted: Sun Mar 23rd, 2008 06:21 pm |
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CardinalFang, there is some info somewhere on the score info sheet that tells you how to compute how likely a kid is to increase his or her score. I don't remember where it is; I just remember my H and S doing the computation.
That said, I agree with the other posters who said that your son's done well enough (and better!). Congrats to him and to you.
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Deja
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Posted: Mon Mar 24th, 2008 11:15 pm |
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limner wrote: CardinalFang, there is some info somewhere on the score info sheet that tells you how to compute how likely a kid is to increase his or her score. I don't remember where it is; I just remember my H and S doing the computation.
My high school junior son took the Jan 26 SAT, and on his score report it had a section "Will Your Scores Change if You Take the Test Again?" Then it goes on to list what percentage of students with his exact score (by section) got higher, lower and the same score on a second testing.
He's considered taking it again, because he really wanted to score an 800 on CR (he got an 80 in the PSAT), but I don't think he's going to chance it. Besides, he has plenty of studying left to do at this point with five APs in May and three SAT2s somewhere in there!
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Mon Mar 24th, 2008 11:45 pm |
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According to the data, the closer a tester comes to the ceiling score and the more re-takes s/he does, the less likely s/he to improve her/his score on a subsequent re-take. This suggests that differences in very high scores can be increasingly attributed to random fluctuations and that gains to be made by acquiring familiarity with the test diminish with each re-take.
Last edited on Mon Mar 24th, 2008 11:47 pm by Descartes
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Consolation
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Posted: Mon Mar 24th, 2008 11:54 pm |
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Deja wrote: He's considered taking it again, because he really wanted to score an 800 on CR (he got an 80 in the PSAT), but I don't think he's going to chance it. Besides, he has plenty of studying left to do at this point with five APs in May and three SAT2s somewhere in there!
My S took the SATs twice for the same reason: he got an 80 on the math section of the PSAT and wanted to duplicate it on the SAT. Unfortunately, his plan did not include actually *studying* for it, so he only raised his score 10 points. (He did, however, repeat his 800 on the CR.) Kids...what can you say.
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Deja
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 12:05 pm |
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| My son's 790 in W is apparently useless...do any colleges even care about the Writing score?
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limner
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 12:45 pm |
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| Deja, my son had a 800 on the writing, sigh. I believe I remember Carolyn saying that it certainly wouldn't hurt. Since the schools have to *see* the score, since it's right there, it may have some impact. One just doesn't know--it's a lot like the rest of the admissions process.
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Consolation
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 01:55 pm |
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Deja wrote: My son's 790 in W is apparently useless...do any colleges even care about the Writing score? Some of them seem to. Anyway, I figure my S's 780 won't hurt him either.
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 02:44 pm |
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The Writing section was adapted from the SAT II Writing test, which in turn was a required test by many selective schools for many decades (I remember that from my days as a college applicant). It seems highly unlikely that these schools would be ignoring it now that it is part of the "reasoning" test. It is possible, however, that they might not treat it as equivalent to the Math and CR sections.
It is my impression (and someone more authoritative can chime in here) that the alleged disregard schools have for the Writing section stem from admission officers' comments about not looking at "the writing part of the test." Reports of these comments always seem ambiguous to me in that they might refer specifically to the new essay portion of the test (which can influence final scores by a little) and not the "objective" questions involving usage, grammar, punctuation, and accuracy (which constitute by far the bulk of the test). It is probably true that few schools actually read the essays which the College Board makes available to them. And it is also true that there is some doubt as to whether scoring an essay written in 25 minutes sheds any real light on a student's abilities. However, when I read interviews with such comments, it seems to me that the reporter is often unaware of the distinction between the essay and the objective questions and thus fails to clarify what, exactly, is being ignored.
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CardinalFang
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 02:54 pm |
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In some of the guidebooks (e.g. Princeton Review), a middle 50% SAT range is published for each school. Some colleges list a middle 50% for the Writing section of the SAT, and some don't. In particular, of the schools I've been researching, Kenyon, Pomona, Lewis & Clark and Lawrence do list a middle 50% for the writing portion. I'm making the simplifying assumption that colleges that list the section care about the section, and the other colleges don't.
Luckily for Fang Jr, whose worst section is Writing, most of the schools he is investigating don't consider that section.
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Consolation
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 03:56 pm |
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CardinalFang wrote: I'm making the simplifying assumption that colleges that list the section care about the section, and the other colleges don't.
I made the same assumption.
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lfm
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Posted: Tue Mar 25th, 2008 11:47 pm |
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Consolation wrote: CardinalFang wrote: I'm making the simplifying assumption that colleges that list the section care about the section, and the other colleges don't.
I made the same assumption.
I think that schools are holding back from adopting the CR section, but might in the future. They are waiting to be convinced that the section is worth looking at.
OTOH, I also think that all schools know that some kids do not test well, and to discount poor scores from an otherwise good candidate.
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Deja
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Posted: Wed Mar 26th, 2008 10:56 am |
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Descartes wrote: The Writing section was adapted from the SAT II Writing test, which in turn was a required test by many selective schools for many decades (I remember that from my days as a college applicant). It seems highly unlikely that these schools would be ignoring it now that it is part of the "reasoning" test. It is possible, however, that they might not treat it as equivalent to the Math and CR sections.
It is my impression (and someone more authoritative can chime in here) that the alleged disregard schools have for the Writing section stem from admission officers' comments about not looking at "the writing part of the test." Reports of these comments always seem ambiguous to me in that they might refer specifically to the new essay portion of the test (which can influence final scores by a little) and not the "objective" questions involving usage, grammar, punctuation, and accuracy (which constitute by far the bulk of the test). It is probably true that few schools actually read the essays which the College Board makes available to them. And it is also true that there is some doubt as to whether scoring an essay written in 25 minutes sheds any real light on a student's abilities. However, when I read interviews with such comments, it seems to me that the reporter is often unaware of the distinction between the essay and the objective questions and thus fails to clarify what, exactly, is being ignored.
What you wrote above makes a lot of sense. And the W section of the PSAT is counted equally when adding the three parts to get the index (and has been for years).
I think it was Dean J (from UVA) on CC who wrote that it is very hard to see writing samples from the SAT, because they come in huge (thousands) groups from College Board.
Good point, CardinalFang, about some colleges posting the middle 50th percentile scores for W. Those colleges must look at the W section of the SAT. I hadn't thought of that (I haven't really looked at any of those books; only looked at stuff on the web).
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Consolation
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Posted: Wed Mar 26th, 2008 11:52 am |
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I don't know about anyone else, but I attempted to look at my S's writing section essay on the College Board site. It was virtually impossible to read. His handwriting is not exactly wonderful to start out with, and when you combine that with being written in pencil and then scanned, the results are poor, to say the least. I could only pick out stray phrases.
I can hardly imagine how the scorers managed, much less envisioning admissions officers with thousands of files to read attempting to do so.
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outwest
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Posted: Thu Mar 27th, 2008 02:59 pm |
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I did the same thing. My Ds essay was practically illegible. She has atrocious handwriting and is a very good writer. In both takes of the SAT, her multiple choice score was terrific, but her writing score was mediocre. I can only surmise that they coudn't read the darned thing without effort. When you have to work at reading it, I am sure it colors the score they give.
Two of the schools my D applied to seem to count the writing score. One of them said the writing scores varied too much from test to test, so they didn't count them. Another said that writing is not something that can be timed and forced, so they don't count them, either.
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Deja
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Posted: Thu Mar 27th, 2008 03:28 pm |
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outwest wrote: I did the same thing. My Ds essay was practically illegible. She has atrocious handwriting and is a very good writer. In both takes of the SAT, her multiple choice score was terrific, but her writing score was mediocre. I can only surmise that they coudn't read the darned thing without effort. When you have to work at reading it, I am sure it colors the score they give.
I think I read (on CC, I'm sure!) that essays written in cursive statistically get better scores than those that are printed (my sons print). I'm sure that essays in beautiful handwriting get scored higher, too, especially since the scoring is so subjective.
I hadn't thought of looking at my son's essay. I guess I'm really not that familiar with the Collegeboard site!
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