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Wstrdg
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Posted: Sat Mar 8th, 2008 11:55 pm |
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I have two questions:
1. Math minimum is 3 courses: Alg 1, Geometry, Alg 2. If my student took Alg 1 in grade 8, does that count toward the 3 minimum courses? Or is another course required in high school? I'm not talking about what's "better" or "best," just what's the minimum.
2. The CSUMentor site says that a course deficiency may be corrected by a score on the corresponding SAT Subject test. What's the Math II score required to fulfill the third year of math?
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Wstrdg
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Posted: Sat Mar 8th, 2008 11:59 pm |
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Oh well, one more question:
3. The UC/CSU course requirements say nothing less than a C in a "required course." If the course is math, but beyond the minimums, are you okay?
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lfm
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Posted: Sun Mar 9th, 2008 12:21 am |
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From the UC site: ( I think the UC/CS requirements are the same here)
Three years of college-preparatory mathematics that include the topics covered in elementary and advanced algebra and two- and three-dimensional geometry. Approved integrated math courses may be used to fulfill part or all of this requirement, as may math courses taken in the seventh and eighth grades that your high school accepts as equivalent to its own math courses.
I am not sure about the second question, but I am guessing it is ok for A-Gs, but not great for the GPA.
Last edited on Sun Mar 9th, 2008 12:21 am by lfm
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DesperateDad
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Posted: Sun Mar 9th, 2008 03:46 am |
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| Yes, a-g courses (such as math and language) taken in middle school do count towards the minimum admissions requirements. If one receives a D in PreCal (or any a-g course), IMO it's best to repeat that course. Sry, do not know the Math 2 equivalent. But, for UC admission by test only (excl. gpa), applicants need to average 690 on all five tests, if I recall.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Sun Mar 9th, 2008 09:09 pm |
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There's a few caveats. For Math, if you receive a C or higher in the higher level course (i.e., Alg 2), it clears the requirement for the lower level course.
If you receive a D or F in the first semester of a math course, but then get a C in the second semester, you are considered to have "passed" the entire course (but the D or F is still factored into your UC GPA). This only applies to math, not the other A-G subjects (although I seem to recall that it also applies to Foreign language, but double check on that one).
If you took one or more courses towards the three math course A-G requirement in middle school, both the UC's and CSU's strongly prefer to see the courses listed on your final transcript if they are to be used to prove you've met the A-G requirements.
Here's the relevant passage from the UC site:
D and F Grades in Languages Other Than English and Mathematics:
The following special rules apply to D and F grades earned in these subjects.
- Languages Other Than English: D or F grades earned in a course in language other than English are treated as "e" requirement subject omissions and scholarship deficiencies. The student may clear the subject omission and scholarship deficiency by earning a grade of C or higher in a more advanced course in the same language. Both grades are used in calculating the Scholarship Requirement GPA.
- Mathematics: D or F grades earned in algebra or geometry are treated as "c" requirement subject omissions and scholarship deficiencies. The student may clear subject omissions and scholarship deficiencies by earning grades of C or higher in appropriate, more advanced courses in college-preparatory mathematics. For example, a D grade in the first semester of elementary algebra is cleared if the student earns a grade of C or higher in the second semester of elementary algebra. D or F grades earned in elementary algebra are cleared if the student earns a grade of C or higher in intermediate or advanced algebra. D or F grades earned in geometry or intermediate/advanced algebra are cleared if the student earns a grade of C or higher in trigonometry. Both grades are used in calculating the Scholarship Requirement GPA.
D and F Grades in Languages Other Than English and Mathematics:
The following special rules apply to D and F grades earned in these subjects.
- Languages Other Than English: D or F grades earned in a course in language other than English are treated as "e" requirement subject omissions and scholarship deficiencies. The student may clear the subject omission and scholarship deficiency by earning a grade of C or higher in a more advanced course in the same language. Both grades are used in calculating the Scholarship Requirement GPA.
- Mathematics: D or F grades earned in algebra or geometry are treated as "c" requirement subject omissions and scholarship deficiencies. The student may clear subject omissions and scholarship deficiencies by earning grades of C or higher in appropriate, more advanced courses in college-preparatory mathematics. For example, a D grade in the first semester of elementary algebra is cleared if the student earns a grade of C or higher in the second semester of elementary algebra. D or F grades earned in elementary algebra are cleared if the student earns a grade of C or higher in intermediate or advanced algebra. D or F grades earned in geometry or intermediate/advanced algebra are cleared if the student earns a grade of C or higher in trigonometry. Both grades are used in calculating the Scholarship Requirement GPA.
Last edited on Sun Mar 9th, 2008 09:21 pm by CarolynLawrence
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Wstrdg
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Posted: Sun Mar 9th, 2008 09:41 pm |
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I've read all of that, it's clear as mud, but thanks for posting it again, and I guess I need to be more specific with the situation:
8th grade transcript Alg 1 fall A and spring A
9th grade transcript Geom fall A and spring A
10th grade transcript Alg2Trig (advanced) fall B+ and spring A-
11th grade transcript PreCalc fall C and spring: we dunno yet
12th grade will be Advanced Math Topics since this kid is totally burned on math after this year. He should pull B's in that, as it's actually a step sideways (if not down) from PreCalc.
If he should stumble and only pull a D in 11th grade spring semester PreCalc, what will that do to his eligibility?
His overall GPA is in excess of 4.00. His ACT scores are quite nice (with excellent verabal and very good math/science) but he hasn't taken the SAT II subject Math 2C yet. Based on his PSAT scores, I'd guess his math subject test will be around 630.
Carolyn, do you know what SAT subject score will clear math or does he not need to worry about that?
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Sun Mar 9th, 2008 11:49 pm |
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He already meets the A-G requirements, Wstrdog. Algebra 1, Geometry, and Algebra 2 adds up to three years. If he pulls another C in pre-calc, he will have four years. If he gets a D, it will factor into his UC GPA, because it is an A-G course in 11th grade. A D will mean he won't have four years, but he will STILL meet the minimum A-G requirement and be UC eligible. So, the D won't be disasterous in terms of doing away with his eligibility for having the A-G requirements (although a D factored into the UC GPA isn't ideal)
If he gets a "C" second semester, you might just consider not having him take math next year, as he will have four years. If he does take math, make sure that the other math class is a UC approved one (you can check at http://www.ucop.edu/doorways), so he will get credit for a 5th year.
I think he is in good shape, mathwise, even if he doesn't pull off that C this semester.
Sorry, I don't know what Subject test score is required to clear the math A-G requirement, but since he has ALREADY met the A-G requirement with three years, he should be OK in any case. I personally would advise a student who isn't strong in math to avoid the Math IIC test!
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Mon Mar 10th, 2008 01:47 am |
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I did a bit of research and found the following info. on the subject tests scores needed to satisfy the math requirement (again, your son has already satisfied the three years of math with his Alg. 1, 2, and geometry).
For the UC's, a score of 570 on Math 1C or a score 480 on Math IIC satisfies the requirement. (see: http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/educators/counselors/adminfo/freshman/advising/admission/subjectr.html
for the scores needed to satisfy other a-g areas)
Ironically, for the Cal States, the requirement is 540 on Math 1C and 510 on math IIC.
Hope the above link helps.
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Wstrdg
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Posted: Mon Mar 10th, 2008 04:33 am |
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Thank you, Carolyn!
I really don't feel that he "is not strong in math." It's been one of his strengths until he met this particular teacher. There just isn't anyway around her. Most of her students drop out. They can't fire her. She won't retire for another few years. She doesn't offer after school help ("they don't pay me for that"), and she's infamous with the local private tutors, the word they use is "disaster."
The A's that he has in everything else, including honors and AP courses, will heal the damage that this math score does to his GPA. He has nothing but A's in everything else.
His standard math scores have been very good, if not excellent. Overall, for PSAT, he will be "commended" National Merit, and just missed Calif semi-finalist by a few points. His SAT subject scores for math should be well above the scores you gave.
And yes, the course he will take next year is UC-approved.
I'm much relieved. It seems the system, here, is working to look beyond the results of a single course. And I guess that's the way it should be.
Last edited on Wed Mar 12th, 2008 02:37 am by Wstrdg
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outwest
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Posted: Mon Mar 10th, 2008 05:03 am |
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I just read this thread. When my D applied to the UCs there was a spot right on the application to put Junior high math classes of Algebra 1 and beyond.
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