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alanarch
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Posted: Fri May 19th, 2006 07:24 am |
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| I am interested in Macalester for my son. I am trying to get him interested in a school that is too far to visit (we live in New York City). How is the economics dept? Any information would be greatfully appreciated.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Fri May 19th, 2006 07:29 pm |
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alanarch wrote: I am trying to get him interested in a school that is too far to visit (we live in New York City).
Hi Alan --
Just want to make sure you mean that you want him far enough away so that he can't pop home for visits.  Actually, this was something my husband and I considered when looking at schools for my daughter. Although, now that she's going 2200 miles from home...well, maybe being able to pop home for visits would have been nice.
Anyhow, regarding Macalester: I think it is a solid school overall, and I particularly like their requirement that students complete a capstone project for graduation, as well as the international focus throughout the curriculum. The economics department is larger than that at most LACs = they have 7 full time PhD's, and they all did their doctorates at respected economics programs. I like that the department seems to have funding to bring speakers to campus, and the student-edited Journal of Economics sounds like an interesting opportunity for students to get involved with published research. They do have a chapter of Omicron Delta Epsilon, the national economics honor society.
Looking at their list of classes for the past two semesters: the department offered 11 separate classes last fall (some had more than one section) and 15 this past semester (again, some had more than one section). I see that classes are capped at 25 students - I'd want to check to see how firmly they hold to those caps, because when higher level classes are only offered every other year, you want to be sure you won't be shut out. I see that students are only required to take 8 actual accounting classes (they also need to take sevearl math classes) for the degree. The classes seem to be a nice mix of practical (i.e., accounting, finance, etc.) and theoretical and also don't seem too slanted to any particular brand of economic thought.
Overall, it seems like a very decent economics undergraduate program to me, but, of course, you'll need to dig deeper than what is apparent from the online information. For example, I'd like to know how many majors are in the department, availability of internships, study abroad options specifically for economics, etc.
Last edited on Fri May 19th, 2006 07:52 pm by CarolynLawrence
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Fri May 19th, 2006 10:39 pm |
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Our D3 will be looking at Macalester in early September. We will be able to give a report on our return. We are taking our D2 to St Olaf and visiting colleges for D3 on a rather long roundtrip.
We are driving from NJ and will be visiting Illinois Wesleyan, Knox, Grinnell, St Olaf, Carleton, Macalester, Lawrence, Kalamazoo , Wooster and Allegheny. While my W and I have seen most of these schools on prior children's searchers, D3 is new to all of them and it is for her viewpoints and impressions that will govern which schools make it to her list.
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alanarch
Member
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Posted: Sat May 20th, 2006 12:08 am |
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I only meant that it was too far to visit the school. I'm not concerned about the distance of the actual school he goes to. My gut feeling is that he will choose something closer to home like Colgate, Hamilton or Bucknell.
Wow. Carolyn, you really know how to look at a program. I believe that internships are readily available in both cities. Thanks for the info.
JocelynDad, your family must really like driving. I am the only one in the family who would be up for that drive. I would love to hear your report when you come back as we are also interested in some of those schools. Any chance you are looking at Oberlin? One of my concerns about Kalamazoo and some of the others is that they have a high percentage of instate kids. I would like to see a broader national mix.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Sat May 20th, 2006 12:42 am |
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jocelynDAD wrote: While my W and I have seen most of these schools on prior children's searchers, D3 is new to all of them and it is for her viewpoints and impressions that will govern which schools make it to her list.
JocelynDad, thank you for this line in your post. I had just been thinking today that I wouldn't need to re-visit some of the schools I visited with my D. with my son next year --- but your words made me realize that just because my D. didn't like certain schools (or liked others), that Son won't have his own impressions and tastes. Thanks for that reminder, although I'm not looking forward to another full mid-western college driving trip.  On the other hand, the mid-western colleges treated us very well for the most part, especially compared to some of the "cattle calls" we experienced at schools in the northeast, so it won't be all bad.
Last edited on Sat May 20th, 2006 12:44 am by CarolynLawrence
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Sat May 20th, 2006 03:44 am |
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alanarch wrote:
"JocelynDad, your family must really like driving. I am the only one in the family who would be up for that drive. I would love to hear your report when you come back as we are also interested in some of those schools. Any chance you are looking at Oberlin? One of my concerns about Kalamazoo and some of the others is that they have a high percentage of instate kids. I would like to see a broader national mix.'
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Well, first of all, if you want to see the various colleges, there is no other way to do it but by car. Experience has taught us that (with proper planning and use of AAA), we can do the preliminary look see very effectively on two a day basis.
Since we must travel to Minnesota to deliver our D2 and her varied clothes and assorted items, it just make sense to visit enroute , while and on the way home.
Trick is to plan to be in one college's city in the morning and drive to the second so that you can view it in the afernoon and then drive to the next college's city (or close enough). I do the bulk of the driving and wife and D2 slept and read. D3 is not as good a traveler, so we are planning shorter hops. Going from Wisconsin (Appleton) to Kalamazoo will be mostly by ferry across Lake Michigan. Should be a nice break for all and a unique way to see the Great Lakes (at least one of them).
Kalamazoo and Macalester are two colleges that are new to my W and I. That there might be too many in-state students and therefore a 'suitcase' college so that is one of the reasons we are visiting to see for ourselves.
The schools that D3 shows interest about will be visited by D3 in the Spring of her Junior year. Our eldest D lives in Chicago and would be the local contact/transport for re-visiting (overnight) most of these schools.
Timing for our trip allowed for one school in Ohio if we were going to visit Allegheny. D3 visited Allegheny to see S4's graduation in '93, so this visit will be a renewal for all of us. Oberlin just did not impress W and myself in the past, while I liked Wooster and W wanted to see Wooster because her grandfather gave a lecture/talk at that school in 1907, ergo Oberlin/Kenyon/Denison will be viewed on a separate trip by D3 and myself sometime this summer.
Will post our impressions of each school. I rarely concern myself in trip reports with the statistics, they are in most books and are available. Although I do gather every bit of documentation about the school, impressions and instinctive 'feelings' are my primary focus.
Carolyn: I blush, thanks for your salute, I have not always agreed with your advice, but I do admire the throughness and accuracy (based on my own asssessments) of your observations.
Last edited on Sat May 20th, 2006 03:48 am by jocelynDAD
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Pye
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Posted: Sat May 20th, 2006 11:46 am |
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<<if you want to see the various colleges, there is no other way to do it but by car. >>
For complicated historical, geographical, psychological and other random reasons, we are a no car, no driver's license family and prefer it that way. We visited a lot of campuses relying on Amtrak, Greyhound, Trailways etc. and a few local taxi services. Planning it all with maps and schedules was a challenge I enjoyed. Since D would only consider schools accessible in this way, that wasn't a big problem for us--we did Goucher, Wheaton (MA), Skidmore, Sarah Lawrence, Barnard, Brown , Bryn Mawr, Brandeis, Drew --not all in one trip-- and we are fortunate to have some far flung friends and relatives who accommodated us in various places. Agreed the Midwest would have presented a greater challenge---couldn't get my D interested in colleges there.
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CalifCarolyn
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Posted: Sun May 21st, 2006 07:14 pm |
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jocelynDAD wrote: Our D3 will be looking at Macalester in early September. We will be able to give a report on our return. We are taking our D2 to St Olaf and visiting colleges for D3 on a rather long roundtrip.
We are driving from NJ and will be visiting Illinois Wesleyan, Knox, Grinnell, St Olaf, Carleton, Macalester, Lawrence, Kalamazoo , Wooster and Allegheny. While my W and I have seen most of these schools on prior children's searchers, D3 is new to all of them and it is for her viewpoints and impressions that will govern which schools make it to her list.
Can't wait to read your reviews on these colleges Kalamazoo is on my D's list but we won't be able to visit before applications are due. She is going to apply based on conersations at a college fair with the admissions rep. and her research into Political Science/Government/International Studies Programs.
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Sun May 21st, 2006 07:23 pm |
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| Calif-C: While at K - we can get you any publications that are available. Since K starts classes on Sept 12, our visit will be the week prior, so will not be able to comment on the students and campus activities, we intend to tour and meet with Admissions as a first look visit. Since our D is undecided we will be looking at all majors/department during our visit. Let us know what you would like.
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alanarch
Member
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Posted: Sun May 21st, 2006 10:29 pm |
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| JocelynDad, Regarding when you are Kalamazoo, can you try and get a sense what difference it makes that a high percentage of the students are from Michigan. Being from New York, and looking at other colleges, this is always one stat I lookat. It's not the "suitcase" college issue but the lack of national diversity. Many colleges in the "Colleges that change lives" book have this stat and I'm not sure that that is a good thing for out-of-state kids.
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CalifCarolyn
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Posted: Sun May 21st, 2006 10:36 pm |
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jocelynDAD wrote: Calif-C: While at K - we can get you any publications that are available. Since K starts classes on Sept 12, our visit will be the week prior, so will not be able to comment on the students and campus activities, we intend to tour and meet with Admissions as a first look visit. Since our D is undecided we will be looking at all majors/department during our visit. Let us know what you would like.
I'll ask my daughter when she gets back from Disneyland today and see what she would like. Thank-you so much. Her great-grandfather was a graduate of K.
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Sun May 21st, 2006 10:48 pm |
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Alanarch: Will do, mentioned 'suitcase' because this is one of the main IMO problems with high in-state enrollment - going home for weekends and staying in contact with HS friends. If this is a prevalent action then the OOS students are at a limited weekend campus.
As for national diversity, I have never held that to be so important. The mix of interests and thoughts among the students are of a higher priority IMO. Getting a collection of preppy (hippy/freaky/whatever)kids from all over is still a collection of similar kids with the similar ideas and interests and my definition of dull.
Calif-C: Her Great Grandfather IS and will always be a graduate of K , that distinction never goes away.
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Sun Sep 10th, 2006 07:34 pm |
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We were only able to get to St Paul on a Sunday, so we did not go into any buildings at Macalester. It is in a neighborhood setting in St Paul. Busy street traffic is on the east edge of the campus. It is an urban campus, quite compact. There were a number of International students being escorted around the campus in groups of about 20 (saw 4 different clusters), It was obvious that they were (in the most part) seeing the campus for the first time as the Guides were doing the tour bit.
Since D3 will be visiting her sister in the spring, we put Macalester down for a more in-depth look til then.
My impressions were that the campus was small and that the surrounding area was ok, but not stimulating or particularly interesting. Route 94 (east-west link) was about 15 blocks north of campus and the traffic on a Sunday was brisk past the school. I imagine it would be busier during the week.
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Sat Oct 7th, 2006 02:23 am |
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If I might elaborate:
Macalester is a small campus (about 40 acres) in what is primarily a desirable residential area of St. Paul (called Macalester-Groveland). The north boundary of campus is Summit Avenue, a wide tree-lined boulevard that is composed almost entirely of churches and restored houses from the 19th and early 20th centuries (its worth a trip up and own the street just to get a sense of the history of St. Paul). Paralleling Summit one block south is Grand Avenue, which is a somewhat funky mix of shops and residences.
Snelling Avenue, perhaps St. Paul's busiest residential street, cuts North-South through campus and is indeed quite busy, although still freely moving.
Buildings are generally moderately sized and styled and fit with the spirit of the neighborhood. Overall, the environment is urban but relaxed and very far from a downtown/concrete & glass style.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Sat Oct 7th, 2006 06:55 pm |
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Thanks Descartes for the description. My son is very interested in Macalester, as an increasingly important criteria for him seems to be access to a great city (Which Minneapolis-St. Paul definitely is in my mind!). So, I think Macalester might fit his bill pretty well.
Of course, there simply aren't too many small liberal arts colleges located in or near urban areas -- so I'm pretty sure he'll have to make some concessions.
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Sat Oct 7th, 2006 09:15 pm |
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| I guess the bottom line question most people have in mind is "Is this urban neighborhood safe?" I can only say that I (a docile-looking male) would have no fear walking by myself around the campus or its surrounding streets at any time of day (except for winter, of course, when I might be jumping snow banks...but I digress).
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Sat Oct 7th, 2006 10:46 pm |
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LOL about the snow banks. We're from a small town near San Diego. My daughter is a freshman at Beloit College in Wisconsin. She's already complaining about how "cold" it is. I keep telling her to wait for the wind chill factor to kick in. 
Safety is also a definite concern. We had some doubts about Beloit because of the town itself, but that's a far cry from being in a true urban area like Chicago or NYC. Although, I think I'd feel a little more secure sending my six foot four son into a more urban area than my daughter. Funny how that goes.
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Asdad
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Posted: Sun Oct 8th, 2006 02:08 pm |
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Summer of 05, I was in Minneapolis for a meeting. We were on a bus that drove by Macalester. I thought the street/area was rather nice.
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CalifMom
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Posted: Mon Oct 16th, 2006 12:14 am |
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We recently visited Macalester. My daughter had an interview, attended a class, and we went on a tour.
Prior to our visit, Macalester was #1 D's list. It seems a perfect match on paper. Of course, we were only able to see a snapsnot of life at Mac and so our opinions are just that. I'm combining my impressions along with D's notebook she's given me with notes on each school visit.
The campus is quite nice, in the middle of a very attractive, busy residential area with small stores and restaurants. Little Sister had excellent falafel around the corner while D was busy with her visit. :-) The buildings were clean and in good repair. D felt the dorms were really nice. Our tour guide was very personable and knowledgable. She attended a sophomore Geography class and the instructor was interesting. The students had been given an assignment which seemed basic to D and she was surprised several of the students claimed to not "get it" and didn't have it ready to turn in.
The admissions office was hopping that morning, packed full of students and parents with appointments. D did not hit it off with her interviewer; he was a lot older than any of her other interviewers (egads, probably the nearly feeble age of about 55! ;-)), she felt he was a little rude and made her uncomfortable. She saw a lot of students on campus who were alone, and quite a few who just so happened to look unhappy and/or stressed, so this concerned her.
I can't quite put my finger on it, but while I waited for her in the admissions office and observed students waiting for their tour/interview, the vibe just didn't feel like a good match for D (and I kept my opinions to myself until she'd had a couple of days to digest her observations and started talking about it - if she'd had an extremely positive experience at Macalester and still loved it, I would have kept my mouth shut). It could have been just that the kids were very nervous and trying extra hard to come off as bright and intellectual (which of course they are), but D is a bit more laid back in her brilliantness. ;-)
Anyway, Macalester seems like a great place and I would be comfortable with any child attending for whom it is the right fit. It didn't have the right feel for D and she won't be applying afterall.
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Wed Jan 17th, 2007 12:42 am |
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CarolynLawrence wrote: LOL about the snow banks. We're from a small town near San Diego. My daughter is a freshman at Beloit College in Wisconsin. She's already complaining about how "cold" it is. I keep telling her to wait for the wind chill factor to kick in.
This week "real" winter finally decided to show up in the upper Midwest so I thought of your D and find myself wondering how she is coping now. 
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