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defyingravity1
Member
| Joined: | Mon Jan 7th, 2008 |
| Location: | NYC |
| Posts: | 74 |
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Posted: Fri May 2nd, 2008 07:00 pm |
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http://www.forbes.com/opinions/forbes/2008/0519/030.html
Read the paragraph, then click on Liberal Arts ranking, or Public Univ, or National Universitys. I find the Liberal Arts rankings the most interesting.
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kdmom
Member
| Joined: | Sun Jun 4th, 2006 |
| Location: | Washington USA |
| Posts: | 101 |
| Mana: |   |
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Posted: Fri May 2nd, 2008 08:58 pm |
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I suppose one could argue endlessly about the methodology, but I'll refrain  One could argue with USNWR, too.
There were a few shockers --
Cornell College (IA) is at #97 in the USNWR rankings, but at #21 in Forbes. The Forbes ranking fits my own view pretty well there.
However, Claremont McKenna is #11 in USNWR and #61 in Forbes! Wow, that can't be right, can it? Not in my book.
Of course, I would tell students not to bother with the rankings. In the end, they can't tell you what's right for you.
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CarolynLawrence
Administrator
| Joined: | Sun Mar 5th, 2006 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 3077 |
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Posted: Fri May 2nd, 2008 11:13 pm |
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Mentioning rankings, US News has caused quite a stir in the counseling world. They asked high school counselors to complete their own rankings of colleges. Sounds like a good idea, right? Well, guess again. They only asked counselors at high schools that were ranked on US News "Best High Schools" rankings to participate, and, when I opened my copy of the survey, not a SINGLE LAC was included on the colleges we were asked to rank. A counselor called for a boycott on the NACAC counselor list-serv, which gained momentum after the director of research at US News refused to say how they might use the counselor rankings until "after we have a chance to see what they say." So, if they do include counselor rankings somehow next year, keep that in mind.
This is not the first go-round I've had with the US News director of research. They seem to have some very interesting approaches to statistical accuracy over there.
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CarolynLawrence
Administrator
| Joined: | Sun Mar 5th, 2006 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 3077 |
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Posted: Fri May 2nd, 2008 11:15 pm |
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As for the rankings in Forbes, I must have missed the announcement when Beloit College became Beloit University. 
And, I still laugh at calling West Point a "liberal arts college."
Last edited on Fri May 2nd, 2008 11:16 pm by CarolynLawrence
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Thumper
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| Joined: | Sun Mar 5th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 220 |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 02:05 am |
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| Carolyn...does Forbes rank the Masters Universities (like Santa Clara). I didn't see any of them on the lists in the article.
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Fireflyscout
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| Joined: | Sun Mar 5th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 165 |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 02:46 am |
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Forbes bases part of its ratings on the ratemyprofessors website. Carleton students do not use that website because they have professor reviews on the internal Carleton network.
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outwest
Member
| Joined: | Sun Mar 4th, 2007 |
| Location: | CA |
| Posts: | 484 |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 03:28 am |
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Even Carolyn must have noticed the significant jump Reed took. Reed is #12 on Forbes, but #54 on US News. I always equated their US News rank to their punishment of them for not filling out the forms. My Ds new college didn't budge and is 25 on one and 24 on the other. I wonder what that means? Nothing. To me, if the college is on there at all it is a recognition of a good job, but if a college isn't on there it doesn't mean much. I still think Mills College gave my oldest D an outstanding education, for example.
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 03:39 am |
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With the focus on student experience (via prof ratings) and outputs (Who's Who listings), I can appreciate this approach much more than the USNWR inputs approach.
However, Website prof ratings are hardly reliable both in terms of completeness of participation and comprehensiveness of experience. A better data source in both regards would be the National Survey of Student Engagement (NSSE), which includes opinions not only of instructors but of overall classroom experience and campus life in general. And Who's Who is, perhaps, a broad way of evaluating "success", but Ph.D. and professional degrees earned by graduates should also be included. And let's not forget graduation rates. That's an output, too.
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 03:48 am |
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RatemyProfessor is an avenue for students to complain and to give any Professor that has 'ticked the student off' a poor grade.
That said, were I a student on any campus, I would check to see the ratings before I selected that Professor to be one of mine next semester's Prof's/
I do not believe that the ratings on such a blog are relevant for selection of a college or for giving a rating to that college.
One of D2 Profs at St Olaf is a very tough grader requires a lot (maybe too much) of her students. She is an excellent teacher, but must be a pain during the semester.
I am glad that St Olaf has her on the faculty, but her ratings on Rate myProf would be seen as a negative in the Forbes calculation.
Much as I dislike ratings in general, I cannot get away from them, now that I have all seven of my children in college, S2 has the nerve to ask my help with my oldest grandson who will be a HS Sophomore this fall. 
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outwest
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| Joined: | Sun Mar 4th, 2007 |
| Location: | CA |
| Posts: | 484 |
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 04:02 am |
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jocelynDAD wrote: Much as I dislike ratings in general, I cannot get away from them, now that I have all seven of my children in college, S2 has the nerve to ask my help with my oldest grandson who will be a HS Sophomore this fall.
I think you have more then paid your dues. It seems S2 needs to step up, but maybe you could offer a few pointers.
Why don't they include professional degrees and PhD rates on these things? Those are easily accessible and certainly part of the 'after' picture.
If they included grad rates the said Reed would be in the toilet, but a degree from Reed is a mighty thing to have, so where is the balance? In contrast, a school with a super high grad rate may just be sliding everyone through. I don't place much stock in grad rates at all! Of course you want your kid to graduate, but whether they do or not is entirely up to them and not the schools fault, is it not?
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Canadian
Member
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 05:40 am |
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I wish I didn't pay any attention to rankings, but I do.
Here are the kinds of things I'd like to see ranked:
How many grads join the Peace Corps or other national or international service organizations?
How many start small businesses that profit their community as well as themselves?
What percentage of their time or incomes do they donate to charity?
How many successfully have more than one career?
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Canadian
Member
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Posted: Sat May 3rd, 2008 05:43 am |
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Carolyn,
A school counsellor here, commenting on Maclean's rankings of Canadian schools, said that HS counsellors are asked to rank all the schools. Well, where do they mostly get their info from? Maclean's, of course.
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