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yayamama
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 12:11 pm |
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Would it be beneficial for a student who struggles with standardized testing to take the back door approach to college admissions by bypassing testing? Community Colleges typically do not require SAT or ACT for admissions, but once a student has taken enough community college courses, could enter a 4 year university as a college student and not take SAT or ACT. I don't think that works in California, but I think it would work in other states.
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mackinaw
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 12:40 pm |
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This is a time-honored route to a 4-year college education. I wouldn't demean it as "back-door." Students take the 2-year college route rather than directly entering a 4-year college for a variety of reasons, including (1) it's cheaper, (2) it allows them to make up for a perhaps checkered high school record of grades or test scores, (3) it may allow them to get an automatic admission to a 4-year college after they earn an AA degree.
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Northeastmom
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 01:44 pm |
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Another option is going with schools that are standardized test optional. I also met a young man who refused to take the sats. He claimed that in hs, he just refused to go to school on a Saturday. IMO, he is extremely bright, but just an atypical student. He told me that he felt one could get into many schools without taking these tests. It worked for him. He decided to go to York College b/c it was a financial bargain, and his single mother set financial guidelines. He began by taking 2 classes as a nonmatriculating student. After doing well in those classes, he officially applied to York and was accepted. He feels that one could do the same at many other schools.
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DesperateDad
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 03:04 pm |
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yym:
transferring from a community college to the UC's are quite common. Indeed, the transfer slots at the Unis (and Cal States) give priority to jucos. It's a great way to earn a Cal or UCLA degree, while saving money, particularly if one has a less than spectacular transcript and/or lower than average test scores.
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WestrnMom
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 03:23 pm |
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It is definitely used in California a lot to get into the top UCs. Often students with very good grades will select a CC so they can get into a better UC than they otherwise would because it's so competitive. UCLA and UC Berkeley (Cal), turn away students with 4.0 GPAs if their test scores are not high enough or if the students are still not in the top % for their school. The very competitive high schools that offer many AP classes often have students with weighted 4.0 GPAs who don't make it into the top 4% of students, so may be deferred from UCLA or Berkeley to another UC.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 06:16 pm |
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One caveat: All community colleges are not created equal. Some are excellent, others not so great.
Therefore, I'd do the same sort of research about the community college in question as I would any college. Check the percentages of students who do go on to 4-year schools (and which ones), the drop out rate, availability of general education courses, transfer agreements that the school may have, etc. It is also a good idea to look at the transfer requirements at a few of the 4-year colleges the student might be interested in transferring to, and to try to match up the GE requirements there with the courses taken at the CC as much as possible.
Otherwise, the community college route can be a good one for students who are motivated, but not quite ready for a four year school. As I say, though, I'd do my research first to make sure it is a workable plan that will maximize the chances of transferring.
Last edited on Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 06:43 pm by CarolynLawrence
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 06:36 pm |
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Just wanted to give two links that might be helpful:
Community College Transfers to Elite Colleges
American Association of Community Colleges - has a searchable database for students seeking community college information.
Study on transfer rates from CC's
Fairtest - list of SAT optional schools available here
Last edited on Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 06:42 pm by CarolynLawrence
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DesperateDad
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 08:39 pm |
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| in California, look into the honors programs at the jucos. Successful kids in those programs can have an 80% transfer rate into Cal or UCLA.
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CalifCarolyn
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 09:10 pm |
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Both of my nephews did the CC route. (5 years apart) The older one because he needed to get his HS grades up to get into a UC other than Riverside. The younger one choose that route because although he was accepted into UCLA he took a more pragmatic approach and decided that he would rather save $ and do his "boring" (his words) classes at the CC in small classes. They both took honors classes, became active in school governement and now both are UCLA graduates.
Both completed their AA degrees and were eligible to transfer after 2 semesters and 2 summers. The younger one started his Jr year when the friends he graduated HS with were beginning their Sophomore year
The older one began his Jr year in the Spring of his HS classmates Sophomore Year.
This route worked great for both of them and since money was an issue it allowed them to graduate debt free 
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yayamama
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Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 10:06 pm |
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Didn't mean to demean CC at all! I have complete respect for community colleges and don't see anything demeaning in attending them. I used "back door" to mean alternative option. Rather than the typical high school, applications, standardized testing, 4 year college model.
I know of one here that takes kids as young as 14, has reciprocity with some excellent 4 year universities, including NYU.
I posted under the special concerns thread because I thought the CC route would lighten the test anxiety for students who have difficulty with the time limitations on SATs. I was glad to note that I was wrong, and that the Cal State schools do admit junior college transfers.
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WestrnMom
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Posted: Wed Oct 4th, 2006 03:40 am |
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Don't confuse the UCs with the Cal States. They are different systems. The UCs are Ph.D./research schools that give out more BAs than anything else, with the goal of going on to grad school. Their requirements are more rigorous than the Cal States. The Cal States tend to be good training schools for jobs and careers, are less rigorous and also less costly but still provide excellent educations.
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yayamama
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Posted: Wed Oct 4th, 2006 12:50 pm |
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I did confuse the UC and Cal States. Sorry.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Thu Oct 5th, 2006 01:26 am |
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| Yaya, NO need to apologize. Even folks who live here sometimes get confused.
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WestrnMom
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Posted: Thu Oct 5th, 2006 04:11 am |
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You don't have to apologize to me. I just didn't want you getting the two mixed up if your daughter wants to apply to one of them.
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yayamama
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Posted: Thu Oct 5th, 2006 01:03 pm |
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Oh, westrnmom, I hope my DD doesn't want to apply in CA. It's so far away! And we have no plans to relocate to California. Selfishly, I hope she'll stay within a half a day's drive from us.
But if she does the two year CC route, of course, we'll get an extra two years with her.
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Daaaad
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Posted: Thu Oct 5th, 2006 01:29 pm |
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My brother, who teaches in the California community college system outside San Francisco said they are well known as pipelines to both the UC's and CSU's.
Here is an example:
Where do DVC students go?
(Academic Year 04/05)
Top Twelve Schools DVC Students Transferred To:
1. Cal State East Bay (CSU) 368
2. San Francisco State (CSU) 345
3. UC Berkeley (UC) 174
4. UC Davis (UC) 163
5. Sacramento State (CSU) 111
6. UC Los Angeles (UC) 71
7. UC San Diego (UC) 66
7. Chico State (CSU) 66
9. UC Santa Barbara (UC) 61
10. St. Mary’s College, Moraga (Private) 55
11. San Jose State (CSU) 52
12. San Diego State (CSU) 49
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Daaaad
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Posted: Thu Oct 5th, 2006 01:33 pm |
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PS. Back in Illinois, my local CC, College of DuPage, has a specialized honors program geared specifically to meet transfer requirements to top institutions.
In fact, a few years back one of their graduates became a Rhodes Scholar.
Not bad for a CC. Saves a lot of money too.
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PrimetimeMom
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Posted: Fri Oct 6th, 2006 03:24 am |
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I think if a person is a highly motivated student a CC is a great place to start if you want to save money. If a student is immature and/or not a self starter it may not be a two year pipeline into a UC.
It is hard to park at the CC's here in CA and you need to take a shuttle from a parking lot at my D's campus and the shuttles are not always reliable or on time. Hence, you should arrive at 7am for an 8am class. Consequently, she was dropped from her 8am class. Also, some teachers are wonderful and others are clearly not. I would highly recommend checking out the Professors ratings on http://www.ratemyprofessors.com. You need to take it with a grain of salt but on the whole it has proved fairly reliable.
Again, I think the CC's are great in CA but in our situation this may prove to be an inordinately long college stint at CC before being able to transfer  - if ever...
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Fri Oct 6th, 2006 10:10 pm |
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When I was doing my MBA at San Diego State, several of the required core classes were shut out due to overcrowding. My advisor told me to take the courses at a community college. I did. I had EXCELLENT teachers, and the classes were much smaller than the MBA classes at SDSU. So, that can also be a benefit of starting at some community colleges, especially if the alternative is a large public with huge intro. lecture classes (SDSU has one classroom that can seat 1,000!). By the time you transfer, you'll be into upper level courses, and not have to deal with that.
But, again, as with four year colleges, all community colleges are not created equal, so it's important to do the same sort of research you would with any college before making the final choice.
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HImom
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Posted: Wed Jun 6th, 2007 08:27 am |
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My D will be enrolling in the local community college instead of completing her senior year because she just can't physically handle the rigorous schedule her HS demands. Her brother also had challenges with it but somehow was able to graduate in spite of it. He's been much healthier & happier in college because he has so much more control over his schedule & isn't being forced to hand in tons of busy-work & homework. We hope this will also work better for our D.
The HS was surprised when we told them that all she needed was to take & pass a GED test this summer & start school at the CC in the fall. She's elected NOT to try senior year at a new HS because we suspect she'll have the same problems & more at any new HS that she was having at her prior one. Because of her chronic health issues, she just CAN'T physically be up at 6:15 & go from 7:45-3pm M-F to class, come home to mounds of homework, rinse & repeat 5 days/week for any duration. She does not have the physical stamina.
Anyway, we're all getting excited about a new start and hope this gives the docs time to come up with treatments that will be more effective than those she's few she's tried to date.
The HS has graciously offered to have the HS college counselor help her when she searches for the best 4-year college to transfer to. He confirmed that the Us won't look at her HS transcript if she applies to be a rising junior. This will also save us some $$--no private school tuition for a year & CC is much cheaper than the Us.
Last edited on Wed Jun 6th, 2007 08:29 am by HImom
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