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Wstrdg
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Posted: Thu May 8th, 2008 05:01 am |
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http://www.nacacnet.org/MemberPortal/spaceavailabilityresults.htm
To view results of NACAC’s 2008 Space Availability Survey, select a state and click “View Results.” Colleges will be updating their listings on an ongoing basis throughout the summer.
Survey results will be removed from the NACAC Web site on September 1, 2008.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Thu May 8th, 2008 04:21 pm |
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The Common App also has a list of schools that are still taking applications.
However, I wouldn't assume that these are the only schools that would still consider an application. It is always worth calling schools of interest directly and asking if they'd take a late application, even if they are not on the NACAC list. Many rolling admissions schools, for instance, take applications up until the day school starts. NACAC notes that it only surveys about 1100 out of the 2200 4-year colleges in the US and none of the junior colleges.
By the way, according to NACAC, the number of schools (295) that are on the space availability survey this year is about the same as it has been in previous years. Actually, it is a little higher than last year.
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Mrs. Aardvark
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Posted: Thu May 8th, 2008 06:38 pm |
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Carolyn, thanks for the extra "by the way" comparing last year's list to this year's.
With all the frenzy about demographic surges and application torrents, it is good to hear a cool headed statistic indicating things haven't changed THAT much.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Fri May 9th, 2008 01:40 am |
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| One other thing, Mrs. A, since your son is a junior: the Space Availability Survey can be a good tool for scoping out potential safer bets for next year. I have noticed over the past five years, that often when a very good college (such as Goucher or the College of Wooster) hasn't reached it's hoped-for yield one year, they tend to be a little more flexible in admissions and sometimes a bit more generous with merit money the following year in order to insure they get a full yield. So, I would suggest that juniors scan through the schools listed, and look for some hidden gems that might be of interest for next year.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Fri May 9th, 2008 01:44 am |
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Mrs. Aardvark wrote: With all the frenzy about demographic surges and application torrents, it is good to hear a cool headed statistic indicating things haven't changed THAT much.
Some other hard pieces of data that I like to point out:
--The national average acceptance rate for all colleges is still hovering at 70% according to NACAC.
-- By my count, there are only 130 or so colleges and universities out of 2200+ four year colleges that reject more students than they admit.
--According to an annual survey of over 200,000 college freshmen conducted by UCLA, 80% report they are attending their first or second choice college.
--A lot of colleges scramble to fill up their freshmen classes each year. Even some of the "name brand" schools worry about their yield - that's why they rely on waitlists so heavily.
--Contrary to media hype, there is absolutely NO shortage of seats in college classrooms for anyone who wants to attend.
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HijinksAndSue
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Posted: Fri May 9th, 2008 09:10 pm |
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I wonder when that list was compiled/released.
I know that accepted Berklee freshman who sent in deposits just recently have already been informed that all of the dorm spaces are gone and the only options left are off-campus apartments they would have to get on their own, so it's odd to see they show housing available.
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Consolation
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Posted: Sat May 10th, 2008 12:21 am |
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CarolynLawrence wrote:
Some other hard pieces of data that I like to point out:
--The national average acceptance rate for all colleges is still hovering at 70% according to NACAC.
-- By my count, there are only 130 or so colleges and universities out of 2200+ four year colleges that reject more students than they admit.
--According to an annual survey of over 200,000 college freshmen conducted by UCLA, 80% report they are attending their first or second choice college.
--A lot of colleges scramble to fill up their freshmen classes each year. Even some of the "name brand" schools worry about their yield - that's why they rely on waitlists so heavily.
--Contrary to media hype, there is absolutely NO shortage of seats in college classrooms for anyone who wants to attend.
I was just reading something about the large number of students who go to college and take out substantial loans, but never manage to finish, ending up with perhaps two years towards a 4 year degree. I seem to recall that the author was advocating more attention to realistic 2-yr degrees. IIf I remember correctly, most of the students in this fix were students in the bottom half of their HS class.
So although there are many seats and many schools that take the majority of those who apply, there is some question whether that represents a real shot at a college degree for many.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Sat May 10th, 2008 05:53 am |
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Hi Consolation. There's actually a very interesting article in this month's Atlantic. It was written by an adjunct English teacher who teaches at a community college and an (unnamed) private college. He talks about his frustrations with some of his students who he feels aren't ready for college level work, in some cases haven't mastered high school work. He raises the same question you do -- are we doing people a service by pushing everyone to college, especially kids who need to take out substantial loans to attend but who have a good chance of not succeeding.
The current 4-year grad rate is pretty dismal - something less than 50% of those who start college will graduate. Is there another path some of those kids should be taking?
As the Atlantic author says, however, who wants to be the one to say to any student, "no, you probably shouldn't go to college because you won't succeed"?
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Chedva
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Posted: Sat May 10th, 2008 02:30 pm |
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As the Atlantic author says, however, who wants to be the one to say to any student, "no, you probably shouldn't go to college because you won't succeed"?
That's the major problem in dealing with statistics and groups: there's no way to know which individual in the group the statistic will apply to. It's like a cancer patient. For the universe of patients, there may be a 30% or 75% or 5% survival rate. But for the individual patient, it's either 100% or 0%, and no one knows which group the individual will be in.
So not only do you not want to be the one to say it because it's mean, but because you have no way of knowing if it's true. That kid may be the one who bucks the odds. Why remove that opportunity?
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Consolation
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Posted: Sat May 10th, 2008 03:37 pm |
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Exactly. But perhaps we could increase the chances of a successful and affordable post-secondary experience for more people by providing a variety of models--and by making them available earlier in the student's career.
In other words, more--and better-- "vocational" education. In my area, for example, students cannot attend the "technology and arts" high school until they are juniors. By then, some kids have been essentially lost.
While stratification of students at an early age is a weakness of education in many other nations, it is also a strength--especially when it offers engaging educational alternatives to kids who really, really need them.
I don't see why a kid could not emerge from a six-year program that included some apprenticeship time, having learned how to keep the books of a small business, read a contract, and write a good business letter. Math through geometry, a knowledge of history and the social sciences that enables the person to be a fully-funtioning citizen, basic science knowledge, enough exposure to the arts so that they can enrich the person's life if they wish...and the confidence that they can be lifelong learners. Why can't we do this, instead of pushing kids into an 8-year program covering a lot of bogus stuff at a questionable level and costing an arm and a leg that offers them nothing but the prospect of remaining in a classroom environment that they may not be engaged in for the forseeable future, or be deemed some kind of a "failure" for not achieving a 4-year degree, no matter what the content of that degree may be?
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Mrs. Aardvark
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Posted: Sat May 10th, 2008 10:00 pm |
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If I remember correctly, most of the students in this fix were students in the bottom half of their HS class.
My daughter just received her ACT scores, and I noted that the ACT provides a minimum score that indicates a readiness for college work.
I wonder how many of those who don't make it fit a certain profile in terms of SAT and ACT scores, HS GPA, course load in high school, etc.?
Carolyn - re: Atlantic article - is that May or June? I looked at Atlantic online, and did not see the article.Last edited on Sat May 10th, 2008 10:03 pm by Mrs. Aardvark
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Consolation
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Posted: Sun May 11th, 2008 01:34 pm |
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Mrs. Aardvark wrotMy daughter just received her ACT scores, and I noted that the ACT provides a minimum score that indicates a readiness for college work.
For the benefit of those of us who don't have access to ACT scores, could you post what that score is?
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Sun May 11th, 2008 04:23 pm |
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| http://www.act.org/research/policymakers/pdf/benchmarks.pdf
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riviera
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Posted: Tue May 13th, 2008 03:17 am |
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America's Most Overrated Product: the Bachelor's Degree
http://chronicle.com/free/v54/i34/34b01701.htm
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Consolation
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Posted: Tue May 13th, 2008 12:25 pm |
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Yes, that's the article! How is the ACT composite derived? Is it a straight average of the sections?
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warblers
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 03:01 pm |
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re: Atlantic article - is that May or June? I looked at Atlantic online, and did not see the article. http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200806/college
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Descartes
Super Moderator
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 03:13 pm |
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Consolation wrote: Yes, that's the article! How is the ACT composite derived? Is it a straight average of the sections?
Yes. Average of scores on all four sections. Averages that end xx.5 get rounded up to xx + 1.
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Mrs. Aardvark
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 03:38 pm |
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Warblers, thanks for the link to the article.
To summarize, the author despairs of people who are wasting their (or their employer's) money on tuition, as they will never be capable of putting together a cogent piece of writing.
The author describes his experience with part-time, evening students, working adults with families.
One point the author did not address is that education failed these students at some point much earlier in their lives. They never learned how to learn, and they don't really have any interest in starting now. They lack intellectual curiosity.
To me, the problem is more severe than having people pushed into college classes who have no business being there. My concern is the state of a society in which these failed students work jobs which require thought and analysis of which they are not capable (example in the article is that of police officers).
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safisher
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 05:44 pm |
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I read the Atlantic Magazine article and it highlights how a good idea can be poorly implemented. For example regarding the public safety officers enrolled in these classes. I believe it is a sound idea for police to be exposed to courses on sociology to more fully understand the pathologies of the communities they serve, government to understand the evolution of the laws they uphold, in both cases well beyond standard high school curriculum.
It is a mistake to translate this idea into "they need to earn a degree" which forces them to take English and other standard distribution requirements which does them and the faculty a disservice. Perhaps more wide use of Certifications for different professions that require relevant course work would be more in tune with the objectives of sending them to college for coursework.
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Mrs. Aardvark
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 05:50 pm |
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safisher, from my reading of the article, these police officers wouldn't have done any better taking sociology than they would have taking English 101.
The ability to read, absorb material, and synthesize it just wasn't there.
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