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defyingravity1
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| Joined: | Mon Jan 7th, 2008 |
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Posted: Mon Jan 7th, 2008 10:49 pm |
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Right now these are the schools I am considering sending in applications to transfer to.
A couple of questions as I know there are parents here that either know of or have kids at all these schools:
. Are the students into learning and academics/ serious about academics?
2. How is the social scene? is there a big party/drug culture and are kids more into doing other things to have fun?
I am looking for a student body of smart intellectual down to earth kids that value more than just partying and drinking and hooking up with every guy they meet.
3. How is the music/ theater depts/ choirs?
4. How is Jewish life?
Also any other schools to look at that are similar to these schools.
I currently have about a 3.2/3.3 GPA
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limner
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Posted: Mon Jan 7th, 2008 11:20 pm |
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defyingravity1 wrote:
1. Are the students into learning and academics/ serious about academics?
2. How is the social scene? is there a big party/drug culture and are kids more into doing other things to have fun?
I am looking for a student body of smart intellectual down to earth kids that value more than just partying and drinking and hooking up with every guy they meet.
3. How is the music/ theater depts/ choirs?
4. How is Jewish life?
defyinggravity1, I can answer the questions about Carleton (as a parent--from the outside looking in). My son also applied to and was accepted at Earlham and liked it enormously.
1. Yes, the kids at Carleton are serious about academics, but I don't get the impression that they're stressed out about them. My son's girlfriend is at UChicago, and he says that--from his one visit to her--the kids at UChi are more driven and maybe more stressed about academics.
2. I think you can drink and do drugs and party if that's what you're into, but there are plenty of other things to do to have fun (and non-drugged/drunk people to do them with). There's definitely no judging whichever path you choose. My son was concerned at first that there might be tons of parties and drinking, but he's found good friends whom he enjoys hanging out with (cooking contests, sledding, etc.--he's looking forward to trying out his new ice skates).
3. There are at least two a cappella choirs and there are theater productions. I know a student who's very interested in theater who chose Carleton, but those aren't my son's interests so I'm afraid I don't know much about them.
4. I don't know about this last one either, since we're not Jewish.
One thing Carls seem to have in common is a sense of humor and not taking themselves too seriously. Carleton is the only school I've seen that mentions a sense of humor in its literature. The kids are curious, the teachers are available and interested, and people are respectful of each other's choices.
Hope this helps a little!
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mackinaw
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Posted: Mon Jan 7th, 2008 11:48 pm |
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I can give a partial answer about Bryn Mawr. I have a niece who graduated from there three years ago,with a major in French literature. She then went on to earn a masters degree in linguistics in the Netherlands.
1. Intellectualism: Bryn Mawr (BMC) is a very intellectual place. A simple indicator of this is that BMC is one of the leading colleges in the country in the percentage of graduates who go on to earn PhD's. Eighth among all colleges and universities in the country in overall percentage earning PhD's, 4th in the humanities, 1st in foreign languages, 1st in anthropology, 9th in area and ethnic studies, 4th in English literature. Those are remarkable numbers and are indicative of a learning environment that is very conducive to independent research and thinking. My source: http://www.reed.edu/ir/phd.html You'll also notice Carleton, Beloit, and Grinnell scoring high on this dimension.
2. Social scene: I don't have any basis for commenting on this. You'd best contact current or former students.
3. Music: my niece was involved in at least two choral groups. When we attended her graduation, one of them performed. The choral group was joint with Haverford, which is just a mile or so down the road, and allows cross-registration of courses with BMC.
4. Jewish life: I can't comment with any sure knowledge about this but my niece seemed to be very comfortable with this aspect of her life at BMC. Though not as useful as personal testimony, this guide to Jewish life on campuses by the Hillel Foundation may be useful. You can enter college name or locatioin and obtain useful statistical information: http://www.hillel.org/HillelApps/JLOC/Search.aspx
Last edited on Tue Jan 8th, 2008 04:49 am by mackinaw
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 02:08 am |
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Thank you so much both of you!
They both sound like great places, though I don't know if I have the SATS or grades for Grinnell or Carleton.
Limner- What were your and your S. impressions of Earlham socially and academically? What about in terms of ECS?
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 03:06 am |
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I can answer about Beloit and somewhat about Earlham. My daughter is a sophomore at Beloit, and would be happy to talk to you if you want a student's insight. She also seriously considered Earlham and attended their summer program where she spent a lot of time with Earlham students and got a good sense of the lay of the land.
1. Are the students into learning and academics/ serious about academics?
2. How is the social scene? is there a big party/drug culture and are kids more into doing other things to have fun?
I am looking for a student body of smart intellectual down to earth kids that value more than just partying and drinking and hooking up with every guy they meet.
3. How is the music/ theater depts/ choirs?
4. How is Jewish life?
1. Students at Beloit are a pretty smart and creative bunch, and take academics seriously for the most part. I would say they are probably a little less "intellectual" than the students at Carleton and Bryn Mawr, but not slackers by any means.
The way my daughter describes the students at Beloit is that there is no Beloit "type." For the most part, she finds her peers unpretentious and open-minded. She also uses the word "quirky" in the positive sense of the word, as in, you can dye your hair purple and no one would think you particularly odd. I would also say that most Beloit students tend to be "do your own thing" types but are not overly "out there" - that also pretty much describes my daughter. She's the type who might dye her hair purple but would use rinse-out dye so she could look normal again by the time the weekend is over.  There are a lot of very creative people at Beloit, so it does have a more "artsy" feel in some ways than other schools we visited, but again, there are so many different types of people at Beloit that it is hard to categorize. The type of person who is least common at Beloit are probably preppy types (you won't see any BMWs in the student parking lot, nor will you see many designer handbags). One thing my daughter really likes is that only a tiny percentage of students at Beloit are actually from Wisconsin, so that adds to the sense that there are many different types of people. She has close friends from Wisconsin, but also from Alaska, California, Georgia, China, Malaysia, Africa, and Colorado. Most of all the people at Beloit are friendly. She says that if she goes into the dining hall and doesn't see anyone she knows she just sits down where ever there's a spot and everyone at the table will start talking to her even if they don't know her. She really likes that sense of community. (By the way, she has the same kind of friendly relationships with many of her teachers, and considers them friends).
My daughter does not party at all and is not into hook-ups (I am not just a mom blinded by her charms, I know this for a fact). She has found a good group of friends at Beloit who have similar attitudes as her, but says they are not straight-laced, just straight-edged. There is a fair amount of drinking at Beloit, and some pot, but my daughter says it is confined mainly to the weekends as during the week most people are focused on studying and extracurriculars. She never feels any pressure to party herself but does sometimes go to parties. She says no one thinks it is strange that she doesn't drink or do other things when she goes to a party. Overall, she has been fairly happy with the social scene, but she is also pretty non-judgemental about the ways other people lead their lives.
2. The music department is on the small side, but does a good job with its resources. It would be fine for someone interested in continuing to play an instrument but there are probably better choices for someone wanting to major in music. Lots of people at Beloit are into music, however, and there is an on campus record label that is completely student run (but financed by the school - one neat thing about Beloit is their Center for Entrepreneurial Leadership which funds student run businesses, some quite successful). My daughter is the art director of Green Light Go, the record label, and they put out between 3 and 4 CDs each year (mainly of student bands). I have no idea about the choir, sorry.
The theater department is very active and the theater major is supposedly quite good as well. The program isn't just focused on acting, they offer costuming, set design, lighting design and directing classes as well. They do several productions each year. Lots of opportunities for non-majors to get involved. The college runs the local public access TV station, which gives students access to film editing equipment. There's a student film contest each year and several beloit alums have made names for themselves in the film industry. There is no film major, however. Beloit co-sponsors the Beloit International Film Festival with the city of Beloit each year, which brings three days of film-screeings, actors, and directors, from around the world, with many of the events happening on campus.
4. We're not Jewish, but my daughter's best friend at Beloit is. There is a decent sized Jewish population at Beloit, but they don't have a kosher kitchen or regular services on campus (at least that I know of) except for special holidays. If you want to know more, let me know and perhaps my daughter can get her friend's impressions. I will say, however, that although people who take their religions seriously at Beloit are treated with respect, the majority of Beloit students are more secular than religious.
Earlham:
1. Students at Earlham are similar to Beloit students in some ways, but more politically correct. One of the reasons my daughter eventually dropped Earlham from the list is that, although she is interested in politics, and quite liberal, she felt that there was too much focus on liberal politics at Earlham. As she put it, I only want to talk about politics once in a while, not every moment of the day. My daughter also felt that the students at Earlham were more "crunchy granola" than the students are at Beloit - more kids who are wearing birenstocks, are vegetarians, who buy their snacks from the natural foods coop, etc. Just a tad more "hippie" than Beloit.
Earlham also differs from Beloit because of its quaker affiliation. Unlike places like Swarthmore which have quaker ROOTS, Earlham really is a quaker institution. This means that everything on campus is done by concesus (including faculty meetings) and there is lots of discussion about tolerance, acceptance, and caring for others. Those are not bad messages, of course, but my daughter thought it got a little old when every class she sat in on somehow related back to oppressed people and doing good for others. Other religions are accepted and welcomed on campus, however (but most students at Earlham are, like Beloit, not terribly religious)
Earlham's campus is much larger than Beloits (they have 600 plus acres of woods alone), but they have fewer buildings, and the buildings are clustered together more closely. Earlham's campus seems more removed from the local neighborhood whereas Beloit's is kind of tangled up in the neighborhood. At Beloit, the campus is clearly divided into the residential side where most of the dorms are, and the academic side, where all of the classrooms, offices, and the library are. My daughter likes that separation (although it is a short walk from one part to the other. It probably takes no more than 10 minutes to walk from one end to the other end of campus).
Earlham is officially a dry campus, but students my daughter talked to said "pleasingly damp" is a better description. We noticed lots of liquor bottles in the dorm rooms we passed by on the tour, and smelled some definite "funny weed" smoke as well.
Earlham is also smaller in terms of number of students. Beloit has around 1350 or so students, Earlham has just over 1,000. That might not seem like much of a differnce, but when you factor in kids who are studying abroad each semester (both Earlham and Beloit have active study abroad programs), an extra 250 people here and there does make a difference.
Earlham's music department is small. I know that Mezzomom's daughter, who is currently a music major, considered Earlham but wasn't particularly impressed with the music there. I don't know anything about their theater department, but from what I could see of their performance space, Beloit has a much better set-up.
Hope this helps - I think that both Earlham AND Beloit are great schools, and they have many similarities, but they do have subtly different flavors. Be sure to visit before making your final choice.
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Canadian
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 08:07 am |
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When we were looking into Earlham, I heard that there were more Jews than Quakers there, for whatever that's worth.
Carolyn,
Funny that just today I was really wishing that we'd visited Earlham. From your comments, I know that S was right, that he would not have particularly liked it. (Just me!) So I feel better.
I think students can truly trust their intuition........and parents can rest knowing it is safe to do so.
defyingravity,
The Hillel site is not always accurate about numbers, but it is a good place to start. It will give you websites and sometimes emails, and then you can contact the Hillel leaders. You can also find these sites through the school websites, generally listed as Hillel or Jewish Students Association. My experience is that the Hillel/JSA kids at small schools will be really happy to hear from you, eager to encourage you to come to their school, and helpful if you decide to visit.
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beazer
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 04:57 pm |
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My daughter is a sophomore at Earlham. She is quite happy there and loves the diversity of the student body. She emphasizes that there's someone for EVERYbody there. It can take a little while to find your people, but they are definitely there. I'd describe her as smart, fairly hip, definitely not a hippie, and used to a diverse urban environment. She was attracted to Earlham by the strong community feeling, the Quaker values, and the varied student body.
There is a fair amount of drinking at Earlham but it doesn't dominate the social scene and is easy to avoid. Academically, my daughter works hard and has been intellectually stimulated by her classes. Earlham, too, rates highly in the number of students who go on to get PhDs.
The music department is small and probably not satisfactory for someone wanting to study an instrument seriously. My daughter has taken flute lessons there and has performed with the flute choir. There is only one flute teacher, whom my daughter is not crazy about, so she is ambivalent about continuing. However, the thing I find wonderful about the music department is its inclusiveness. You can join the gospel choir, drum ensemble, gamelan, or other ensembles with little or no experience, and they will teach you and find you a place in the ensemble where you can find real satisfaction. My daughter is a member of the gospel choir, which has been fabulous -- you don't even have to read music to join, but the performances are GREAT, really inspiring (and our family is not Christian). Last spring the choir went on a performance tour around the Northeast that was a lot of fun. She was in the Javanese gamelan one semester, and this semester is going to join a drum ensemble. I've seen these groups perform and they do a great job, high energy and high quality. There are, I think, three other choirs -- my daughter's roommate is a member of the women's choir and enjoys it a lot, says they do really interesting music. So it's perhaps not a high-end music department but you can definitely have fun and do some interesting things that you might not otherwise get to do.
I believe Jewish life is fairly small in scale -- there is a Jewish interest house where they do monthly Shabbat dinners.
Earlham has a 3-week May Term during which you can take a class on campus or study abroad. Last year my daughter went on a study trip to Spain and Morocco. If studying abroad is important to you, this is a great way to do it, along with the more traditional semester- or year-long programs. My daughter's trip even included a few newly-graduated seniors who wanted to go abroad once more.
Probably the worst thing about Earlham is Richmond, Indiana, which is quite conservative and economically depressed. It has its bright spots, and Earlham students do a lot of community service in town. My daughter's life is focused on campus so she doesn't mind, but it's not a place for someone who wants a dynamic city life while in school.
If you're considering Earlham you should definitely visit to see if it suits you.
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Fireflyscout
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 05:35 pm |
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Adding to the Carleton info -
A cappella is HUGE at Carleton. There are at least 7 groups (maybe one or two more). My daughter also sang in the choir, and I saw them when they toured in New Orleans last year. Their repertoire was quite different from what we had experienced in high school, and I found the selections very interesting. Theater seems more student-run than college-sponsored. SMuT (Student Musical Theater) usually puts on one or two musicals each year (daughter was in "Hair" last spring). There is also a student group (Uninvited Company) which stays in Northfield during the summer and puts on 3 plays.
As for Jewish life, about all I can say is that it seems to be present (I'm not Jewish). There is a Hillel house. I forget what it's called, but each October the Jewish students construct a small wooden house on the campus.
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 06:13 pm |
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Wow! Thank you so much for the detailed responses!
On the Jewish point, we are Reform and fairly non religious, but my Dad wants me to be at a place where there are some things to do if I wanted to, and enough Jews so I would not feel uncomfortable or out of place.
Does anyone know anything about the horseback riding program at Earlham?
Does anyone have any experince with Knox? I heard it is a little but more conservitive, middle of the road than either Earlham or Beloit.
Does either Beloit or Earlham have acapelle? My current school does not, and I think it would be fun to do.
Thank you so much again to everyone who responded!
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beazer
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 06:48 pm |
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Here is Earlham's page describing the choral groups. There is one acapella group:
http://www.earlham.edu/%7Emus/content/choral/
Here's the page on the equestrian program. I don't know much about it except that it's a student-run collective, you can bring your own horse (or not), they participate in competitions, and it's supposed to be a good program:
http://www.earlham.edu/%7Eeceq/
Anyone can take riding lessons, of course.
They have a good wellness center with lots of fitness classes, a climbing wall, and so forth.
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 07:31 pm |
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Beazer-
Thank you so much for the info!
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 07:46 pm |
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In terms of the weekends , what is there to do at these schools? Either that the school sponsers or that the kids do on their own. Carolyn, Limner, Beazer, what is a typical weekend like for your kids? I realize being from far away they can;t just hop on a plane and go home for the weekend.
I find that the weekend is the hardest because during the week one has classes and homework and then during the weekend there is this whole strech of time, usually Friday nights and all day Sat., Sunday is usually reserved for homework.
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Fireflyscout
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 08:41 pm |
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Here's a link to the latest activities at Carleton:
http://apps.carleton.edu/campact/nnb/show.php3?thedate=2008-01-08
There's usually quite a bit to choose from on the weekends; my daughter has told me that she has to pick and choose.
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Tue Jan 8th, 2008 08:51 pm |
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| Fireflyscout- Thanks so much!! Thats def. good to know!! That means that they are doing a good job . My best friend has a friend from church that is a freshman at Carleton. He got in ED from a very prestigious private school and from what I can glean likes it very much. He is also a very outdoorsy person.
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Canadian
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Posted: Wed Jan 9th, 2008 02:23 am |
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From what Fireflyscout said,it sounds like the Earlham students build a Sukkah each year, so they must have a pretty active group.
Re a cappella: In touring LACs, I was amazed at the enthusiasm for a cappella groups. Lots of groups, lots of humour, lots of guys singing and attending too. And the other students seemed to really support their friends and be very proud of these groups. Very, very cool.
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Wed Jan 9th, 2008 02:40 am |
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| Yes they do seem to have a good Jewish population for being in a small conservative town in Indiana
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Canadian
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Posted: Wed Jan 9th, 2008 04:17 am |
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I just remembered that I know of a Jewish Canadian kid at Earlham, talked to his parents, who are active in the Jewish community here. He loves it and the parents are ecstatic about the education he is getting.
I continue to have nostalgia for this school that I've never even seen!
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defyingravity1
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Posted: Wed Jan 9th, 2008 04:51 am |
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Canadian- That is awsome! Yeah they seem to have a little enclave of a Jewish community. I will just have to visit and check it out for myself. I am sure my parents will be thrilled about booking a flight to Indiana 
What schools is your S. applying to?
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Canadian
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Posted: Wed Jan 9th, 2008 06:03 am |
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Please write us a report!
My son has been accepted ED at Colorado College. All the schools he applied to have a lot of athletic students and a strong outdoors club and almost all have a strong ski culture........but CC is the best for that! He is very lucky.
CC Hillel has about 100 kids on their email list. S could care less (so he says) but I'm happy he will have somewhere to go for bagel brunches and holiday meals if he chooses.
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CarolynLawrence
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Posted: Thu Jan 10th, 2008 05:52 am |
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Just commenting about Earlham's equestrian program since it was one of the first things that attracted my daughter to Earlham and when we visited she spent time with members of the Equestrian coop. My daughter had her own horse and was interested at the time in possibly bringing him with her to college. She mainly rides western, and is not into dressage. She felt that the facilities at the Earlham coop were very nice, but someone used to more "fancy" facilities might not. The coop is completely student run, and participating is quite time-consuming. You must be a coop member to board a horse or to ride outside of scheduled classes. My daughter said the trails on Earlham's back acreage were nice.
My daughter emailed the equestrian coop email (should be on the website Beaser gave, or ask admissions for a contact) and found the members very down to earth and extremely good about answering her questions. They also arranged a tour for her when she visited and spent time with her. So, do contact them for more first hand informaton.
If you are looking for Equestrian facilities, definitely also check out Goucher (not too far from where you are). The students there are fairly down to earth and similar in many ways to the students at the other schools you mentioned. Their equestrian program and facilities are excellent, and my daughter felt it actually would be a great place to ride.
Last edited on Thu Jan 10th, 2008 05:54 am by CarolynLawrence
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