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outwest
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| Joined: | Sun Mar 4th, 2007 |
| Location: | CA |
| Posts: | 552 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 4th, 2008 05:32 pm |
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I can't help feeling like we are asking for something for a reduced price (kind of like a sale price) and it is really bothering me. I don't know if it is pride or what. I like the fact that my #2 D is at a public where we just pay the bill in full, no sweat, no fafsa, no loans, no handout, "Here's the money, honey."
I am feeling funny lately about #3 applying to schools where there is no way we can pay the full tuition. Our income is way above the average households in this country. We own our house, we go on vacations, we buy fancy cheese. We aren't living in a tiny apartment in a ratty area, so how can we possibly be asking for what seems like a handout to me? I feel like we have no business asking for a dime from anyone. I also have this mindset that you go through life living within your means. How come people (including me) think that a college is any different? Why should any college give anyone any money? If you can't afford it, then you don't go, right?
As I filled out the profile and the fafsa and answered all those questions, it felt icky, really icky. I don't ask for anything from anyone else in other walks of life. I am the one donating to the charities and volunteering my time whereever I can. I am an RN, I help others, not visa versa. I don't want to ask for money from ANYone. If I can't afford it, I don't buy it.
I think the trouble is that my #3 D wants a little school with personal attention. I know that would be the best for her. She has said that if she can't get in and afford one of those, that she would like to attend community college for a couple years and then transfer into one. That is very mature of her anda perfectly viable option, too.
Does anyone else feel weird about writing those 'explanation' letters (I support my mother, for example, but do not claim her). I feel like I am asking for a handout. People work hard and save for years for their kids colleges. We have done that, too, but have not been able to save $170K it would take to just pay outright. How did all this financial aid stuff start anyway? My mother went to Stanford because she was a good student and her father paid for it. Now all these people think they can go to Stanford and not pay for it.
Aaah, I have mixed feelings about the whole thing. Very mixed feelings.
Last edited on Wed Feb 6th, 2008 05:35 am by outwest
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jocelynDAD
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Posted: Mon Feb 4th, 2008 06:19 pm |
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Outwest:
I grant you that the feeling is 'icky'.
However - it is the system that has been created and that our children join at this junction in their life.
What is the true cost of a four year college???????????????
The number crunchers have so mixed up the data that I doubt that they or anyone in a college administration really knows!
I look at it in this fashion, while we supply our child with uniforms, gloves, bats, balls, skates, shoulder pads or whatever so that they can play baseball or soccar or ice skate or etc. The field or the surface must be mowed or finished, the baskets or the goals must be in place the field prepared etc. We cannot do the latter, the 'system' does the preparation.
Getting the 'best' atmosphere for our child is paramount. If the governors of that atmosphere have a system in place that is beneficial to my child, great, I want him or her to get that benefit.
In later years, she/he might be in a position to help that institution help others as the previous grads may have helped him/her. It is a continuous cycle that no one of us can change or alter.
It is kinda like 'tiltin at windmills' to fight against the system. After all, it probably will be good to your/mine child, It is not as if you are demanding special treatment. The benefits are, in the main, standard practice.
I guess if I order a simple ice cream dish and they serve it with whipped cream and a cherry I would just enjoy it, I certainly would not send it back. 
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Northeastmom
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| Joined: | Sun Mar 5th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 496 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 4th, 2008 06:32 pm |
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I agree with your way your life. I also think that college costs are way out of hand. I also believe the system is set up so that the wealthiest Americans will pay the sticker price, and those who begin to receive the smallest amount of need based aid will be stretched to the max, and that what they are expected to pay (the most that they realistically can). It is a crazy unfair system in my opinion. There is financial redistribution going on. It is a blind item. In an ideal world, I would like to know if my kid is accepted to schools A, B, and C what the price is for that education upfront (before acceptance). I think that it is ridiculous that students at that school are paying different prices and that our price is not disclosed before applying. Discount pricing based upon merit is something else.
I really believe in the past college was easier to pay for. My H paid for his own law school education with a small amount of help from his parents (he is one of four children so you can imagine), and he worked summers painting, and had a weekend job as a waiter. He did take out a few thousand in student loans (don't recall the amount, but it was definitely less than 15k). One cannot pay for law school with 40k in loans today and a summer painting job, and weekend job waiting on tables.
One last thing, I would like it a whole lot better if we did not need to fill out the fafsa and profile. We were so stressed when we did these for the first time. Honestly, we had to call our CPA for help because we did not have a clue as to how to answer some of the questions! What a headache this system is.
Last edited on Mon Feb 4th, 2008 06:41 pm by Northeastmom
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mominva
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| Joined: | Sun Mar 5th, 2006 |
| Location: | DC Suburbs |
| Posts: | 333 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 4th, 2008 07:06 pm |
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Outwest,
We filled out the FAFSA and Profile for the schools for 3 different kiddos as their schools required. We did not get need based aid but these applications qualified our children for (unsubsidized) Stafford loans. This was their investment in their education and a beginning basis for future credit rating.
So, fill out the forms to qualify your student for a 'credit rating tool'; if the school grants her an additional discount, so be it.
Remember, you can accept none, some, or all of the aid offered.
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Consolation
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| Joined: | Mon Apr 9th, 2007 |
| Location: | USA |
| Posts: | 483 |
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 07:15 pm |
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When I went to Wellesley, it cost $3,600 per year. My father, an engineer, probably made $40-60K. We were upper-middle class, but far from wealthy, with no inheritable family assets behind my parents. Now, Wellesley costs about $40,000 per year. Engineers in equivalent jobs are NOT making $400,000-600,000 Instead of making 10 times college fees, they are probably making more like 3 times college fees.
Your kid can pass it forward by giving to the college when s/he graduates.
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WestrnMom
Super Moderator
| Joined: | Fri May 26th, 2006 |
| Location: | West Coast, USA |
| Posts: | 1173 |
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Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 09:58 pm |
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If you quality for federal aid, then you deserve to take it whether you feel it's right or not. They have strict formulas and you won't get anything that you shouldn't have. If your child applies for a merit scholarship, basically that is the school's decision to discount tuition for something in return. Whatever it is (a specific talent, good grades or test scores, etc) it's something important enough to them to grant a scholarship. You should take it and not feel embarrassed or weird about it. College educations should never break the bank. Some students need more personal attention than others. Those who can handle and thrive at a big school with a lower sticker cost, usually go to those schools. Those who need the smaller environments, should be in the right schools for them. The small, private schools have endowments, which is money, or stocks, or other assets donated to them or funds raised specifically for things like tuition discounts or special items for various departments just so the school can continue to provide quality educations for the students they select.
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HImom
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| Joined: | Mon Mar 20th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 261 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 11th, 2008 05:21 pm |
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The US "system" is very tough to figure out. I know that when I graduated HS, I determined there was no way my parents could put all 7 of us thru college on my dad's salary & my mom's small token addition as a substitute teacher, tho we earned a "decent" wage.
I was able to get mostly merit aid to pay for my college & law school, supplemented by summer jobs and working part-time in college. Two of my sisters also got merit aid for their masters degrees but none of my 3 brothers applied for or got any aid. Somehow we all got college degrees and 6 of us also got graduate degrees at out-of-state Us, including several privates. To this day, none of us know how it all worked out, including my dad. He said he didn't have any master plan, other than to encourage most of us to get bachelor's degrees from state flagship U (5 of the 7 of us did).
For my kids, we don't qualify for any need-based aid, which I have told both kiddos in their search process. My S was able to find a good U that gave him significant merit aid which allows us to pay the balance without major lifestyle adjustments. We will just do our best to figure out how to get our D to find a school that works for her AND we can afford. Right now, she's in community college, but itching to transfer because it's such a commuter school & most of her peers have no grand career aspirations--she still most identifies with her HS friends who are all going off to glorious Us as freshmen next fall.
I also had a lot of trouble filling out the FAFSA worksheet and when it showed the amount we were expected to pay, I just gave it up because it is higher than the combined projected educational expenses for both kids. Not sure where they expect us to get the money but am gratified that they somehow believe we're good for it. So far it's working out because the community college is actually cheaper than HS tuition was & H continues to work past retirement age. I have no idea how folks are supposed to pay these bills if they aren't poor or rich enough. I guess somehow everyone figures out a way.
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jocelynDAD
Member
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Posted: Mon Feb 11th, 2008 06:05 pm |
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HIMom:
as our 7th child completes her search this spring, we echo your parents.
our 5 oldest all completed college (no state schools - all provate), one finished Law School, two have their Master's and two have taken certification classes past their Bachelor's, one is a Sophomore and the youngest is on her way.
I am retired so we are on a single salary plus SS/pension: for many years, I had the sole salary and for most of the past 16 years we had duel salaries.\.
How - Scholarships for the older three, FA for the next two and they all took care of their advanced studies themselves, the last two, FA + savings +like your Dad, somehow!
You should IMO complete the FAFSA anyhow, you never know what might be on the horizon, let the colleges decide the availability of aid including merit and FA. You cannot win the pot if you don't ante (submit the FAFSA) up. 
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HImom
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| Joined: | Mon Mar 20th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 261 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 11th, 2008 06:43 pm |
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Really tough doing the FAFSA because our finances are very complicated (it's a long story), so we never get our taxes done until late August. I guess we could do a FAFSA & amend after the tax returns are finally filed or something. Really don't believe we will qualify for anything--we saved too much. Will try to fill out the FAFSA worksheet again.
Thanks for the encouragement.
HImom
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outwest
Member
| Joined: | Sun Mar 4th, 2007 |
| Location: | CA |
| Posts: | 552 |
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Posted: Mon Feb 11th, 2008 11:31 pm |
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Just have the tax guy help do the fafsa and profile if you have trouble with them. You have to send the stuff in before March 1st (the final figures). August isn't going to cut it. They really aren't that bad once I sat down and did them, but every family is different. I was sure we would qualify for little or no aid, but the reality was that it was pretty darned accurate. I hope the colleges agree.
The thing about the fafsa and profile is they don't care what your credit card debt might be or if you have large car payments. They don't care if you have to have HDTV service or need to heat a pool. If you haven't already, the smartest thing to do is take the savings and totally pay off anything that is outstanding (cars are a biggy). It is silly to have a bunch of savings and owe on a car with hundreds of dollars a month in payment.
All colleges allow you to make monthly payments. That is how we got through my first daughter. The best thing about college is that it is a finite amount of time. Four years is not forever. The older I get, the shorter that sounds.
I still cringe that we are asking for money from the colleges, but as others reminded me, it is the system this country has set up- right or wrong. So, I twisted the tax guys arm to finish our return pronto. This morning I mailed off our W-2's and 1040 along with various other pieces the different colleges wanted. We sent them all priority mail with a certificate of mailing, in case someone somewhere says we never mailed the stuff. My D's 1040EZ went into the packets, too, so they can eyeball her summer job money. She gets all of her $92 back she paid in taxes and is very excited about that. All things are relative.
Will she get what she needs? Will she be able to go? Will she even get in? I have no idea, but all the research to optimize her chances, mitigated with her desires, is done. Now we wait for seven colleges. Last edited on Tue Feb 12th, 2008 05:56 am by outwest
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